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Talk:Michael Collins (Irish leader)

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Would anyone object if the book references were converted to Harvard style citations? An example of how they work can be see at Battle of Pontvallain#References. At the moment they are a complete mish-mash of different formats, so it's impossible to even say which, if any, is the current style used in this article.

Also, there are many references that need to be removed. I do not feel like delving through the history to see who is responsible, but it appears that whoever was responsible cited the primary sources that were cited by the secondaryu sources (that's books, generally speaking). That's why there are citations with insufficient information such as;

  • British Cabinet minutes, memoranda
  • MC official correspondence, 5 and 10 April 1922
  • Michael Collins letter to Churchill 6 June 1922
  • Michael Collins – Winston Churchill correspondence June 1922
  • Public Records Office, Dublin
  • Michael Collins field diary, 22 August 1922

The penultimate one is particularly egregious, how is anyone supposed to know what they are looking for?? FDW777 (talk) 22:07, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

No objection here - consistent formatting would be an improvement. BastunĖġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 00:06, 5 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Thank you. WP:WHENINROME does say consensus is required before changing from one style to another, so thought it safest to raise the issue here first. FDW777 (talk) 07:52, 5 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A few minor amendments[edit]

I have made some amendments to a single paragraph to remove any bias or presumption of motive. As follows:

From: Collins and his Squad killed several British secret service agents in a series of coordinated raids. To: Collins and his Squad killed several people in a series of coordinated raids, including a number of British secret service agents Reason: Not all the of those killed were members of Cairo gang and at least one was just a member of public.

From: In retaliation, members of the Royal Irish Constabulary To: Members of the Royal Irish Constabulary Reason: This is a presumption of motive given by IRA propaganda at the time.

From: A stampede of panicking British operatives To: Many British operatives Reason: This is not a NPOV statement. (talk) 16:33, 23 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Suggestion to Editors of This Page[edit]

One of the paragraphs in the article references Michael Collins' election as a "Teachta Dála" in 1918, although An Dáil Éireann was formed in 1919. Would it not be more suitable to change the statement to "he was elected an MP, later serving as a TD after the forming of the Dáil Éireann on 21 January, 1919" This is just a suggestiom, I may be wrong which is why I will leave this to any editors and experts on the subject. (talk) 21:55, 7 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Good point, thank you. Terminology tweaked to clear this up Billsmith60 (talk) 20:15, 13 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The redirect Michael Collins (Irish leader has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2024 March 3 § Michael Collins (Irish leader until a consensus is reached. Utopes (talk / cont) 18:28, 3 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"Death" or "Assassination"?[edit]

A recent editor contends that "people killed during military engagements in a war aren't assassinated", I would dispute this, assassination is often a tactic of war and is described as such; see: Assassination of Reinhard Heydrich and Dzhokhar Dudayev, where the killings of military leaders in operations specifically intended to target them in the context of military conflict are described as assassinations. The circumstance of Heydrich's death in particular is rather similar; a high-ranking officer was shot in an ambush while he rode in a vehicle. BRMSF (talk) 15:04, 10 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]